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England criticism falls on deaf ears

7:00am Friday 14th November 2008

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England are ignoring all the press flak as they prepare for tomorrow’s World Cup semi-final showdown with New Zealand in Brisbane.

Tony Smith’s team have been showered with criticism from all angles after an unconvincing 32-22 victory over Papua New Guinea and group defeats against Australia (52-4) and New Zealand (36-24).

The English press have stuck the knife in, as has former Wigan and Saints coach Ian Millward and the Aussie media.

But England’s assistant coach Steve McNamara said prior to the rematch against the Kiwis: “We don’t read the papers, although we have heard bits and pieces.

“The mood in the camp is very good, although we understand that we could have played a whole lot better in previous games.

“But we came out here with a job to do and we are fully focused on that.”

Bulls head coach McNamara admitted the players were upset with their performance last weekend and with the decision-making. “It was our performance in the second half that was particularly disappointing,” McNamara added.

“But we learned a whole lot about ourselves. We played some good stuff in the first half and overall we learned a lot about some individuals.

“Nevertheless, we are feeling confident.”

Neither of the Bulls players – Jamie Langley and Paul Sykes – have made it into the 19-man squad for the contest at the Suncorp Stadium.


Your Say YourBradford

BBARL6, Bradford says...
8:52am Fri 14 Nov 08

Unfortunately to be honest i dont think Neither of the Bulls player deserves a place after the way they played against the Kiwis.

micksey, Wibsey says...
10:00am Fri 14 Nov 08

I thought Langley did okay, bearing in mind he was being asked to play down the middle when he was on. Sykes was very disappointing though. But that said I felt Smith should have shouldered much of the blame and his response on the BBC last Sunday was distinctly underwhelming. The team look poorly prepared and that's why they look clueless and poorly motivated on the field. This is partly down to a lack of genuine quality in the squad for sure, but it's also big time down to the coaching and preparation make no mistake. Steve Macnamara has to hold his hand up too.

haitch, Lincolnshire says...
11:35am Fri 14 Nov 08

BBARL6 wrote:
Unfortunately to be honest i dont think Neither of the Bulls player deserves a place after the way they played against the Kiwis.
I agree with you there and it's worrying to think they can't break into that poor squad. The only thing I would add BBARL6 is that whilst Sykes and Langers may not be worth their place neither are the majority of the guys who will be playing! Can't remember a weaker squad. I reckon Smith and Macca are silly not to listen to the criticism. Deaf ears never made a good coach IMO.

BBARL6, Bradford says...
1:25pm Fri 14 Nov 08

Agree that some of the othe players look out of place also, but when you get once chance to impress for a place you need to put your body and soul in to your performance, forget everyone else. Langley far too slow in both attack and defence at that level and Sykes, he needs to remember how to complete a tackle, his defence at the moment is terrible. Ok hes not a winger, but even someone with his experience should not have been caught out wide as many times as he did.

Mick De Bull, Odsal says...
1:41pm Fri 14 Nov 08

I feel sorry for all those fans that have paid thousands of pounds to follow there national team down under to watch what can only be described as CRAP. And as for that dive that now tops my list and has taken over from the voluntry tackle that lost us the grand final as the worst thing a player could do. He should be BANNED for ungentlemanly conduct.

haitch, Lincolnshire says...
2:54pm Fri 14 Nov 08

BBARL6 wrote:
Agree that some of the othe players look out of place also, but when you get once chance to impress for a place you need to put your body and soul in to your performance, forget everyone else. Langley far too slow in both attack and defence at that level and Sykes, he needs to remember how to complete a tackle, his defence at the moment is terrible. Ok hes not a winger, but even someone with his experience should not have been caught out wide as many times as he did.
You are right.that's why I said "it's worrying"!!

Bev, Leeds says...
2:56pm Fri 14 Nov 08

Smith would impress me more if he looked at the person he is talking to rather than gazing around as if looking for divine intervention. I'm sure it's a lack of confidence rather than rudeness but it needs addressing. At least every sentance doesn't contain ' at this moment in time, like his assistant!

haitch, Lincolnshire says...
4:46pm Fri 14 Nov 08

Bev wrote:
Smith would impress me more if he looked at the person he is talking to rather than gazing around as if looking for divine intervention. I'm sure it's a lack of confidence rather than rudeness but it needs addressing. At least every sentance doesn't contain ' at this moment in time, like his assistant!
Come on Bev!! who's bothered how they look or what they say..leave all that to the 'Celebs' we are plagued with these days and lets just concentrate on how well(or otherwise) they coach??

Mick De Bull, Odsal says...
4:48pm Fri 14 Nov 08

Bev wrote:
Smith would impress me more if he looked at the person he is talking to rather than gazing around as if looking for divine intervention. I'm sure it's a lack of confidence rather than rudeness but it needs addressing. At least every sentance doesn't contain ' at this moment in time, like his assistant!
At this maoment in time I would suspect you could be a Rhino, his assistant has to say what he is told to say by higher manager, it could be Smith who promts him

micksey, Wibsey says...
7:17pm Fri 14 Nov 08

Sound sit to me too Bev, quite what Macnamara's turn of phrase has to do wuith the embarrassingly ill prepared and clueless state of our national side I'm not sure. My vie wis Macca's not blameless in this either but ultimate responsibility rests with the boss and Smith is on a win or bust deal this weekend. Another limp wristed tactically inept humiliation and he has to go in my view. Brian Noble understood that to stand a chance against the Aussies you have to match them physically and make themn fight. Smith has been made to look a fool because he thought he was too smart, too clever for that sort of approach. He knows now.

haitch, Lincolnshire says...
8:45pm Fri 14 Nov 08

In any other comp a team would have to WIN matches to get to the Semi Final. Smithy may still be remembered for coming 'so close' to making the world cup final and only actually beating PNG. That's some record!!

Bradford1903, The Kop says...
3:13am Sat 15 Nov 08

Nobody gave Leeds a chance when they beat St Helens in 07, and Smith was coach. Not saying we'll win 2moro, but there'll be better odds than they were then, I believe it's 50/50. Can't believe they are playing Calderwood over Gardner on the wing though, never mind try scoring ability, you need someone who can defend

andy j, liversedge says...
12:12pm Sat 15 Nov 08

gardner was our worst player and gleeson our best, too many unforced errors today and yet better defence than last week. the aussies will destroy the kiwis next week!

haitch, Lincolnshire says...
2:16pm Sat 15 Nov 08

Smith said it was the best prepared side ever to leave these shores.

Smith also said he would not listen to criticism.

Mickster said it was a brilliant competition.

Macca said he thought we could nail the Kiwis this time.

How can so many eminent experts be so wrong??

Adey, Bradford says...
4:28pm Sat 15 Nov 08

Thank god we can't pin a very very very embarrassing world cup on a Bulls player...they only played in the dead rubber match and even had they played well they wouldn't have got another chance. Wilkin, Sinfield, Gardener & Wellens, total jokes!

shaun from richmond, richmond says...
4:46pm Sat 15 Nov 08

Adey wrote:
Thank god we can't pin a very very very embarrassing world cup on a Bulls player...they only played in the dead rubber match and even had they played well they wouldn't have got another chance. Wilkin, Sinfield, Gardener & Wellens, total jokes!
Er....We dont have anyone good enough to get in that so called team!!!!!
Mind you at least we sent Macca over to give the England boys that much needed lift??!!
God help us next season!!!!

Bev, Leeds says...
5:18pm Sat 15 Nov 08

I might live in Leeds but I am a lifelong Bullliving among the herd. You can't get away from the fact that neither coach comes across as convincing to us let alone the players who have to suffer the pain.
I'm not writing them off, just making a point

spanglishbull.uk, Roldan Murcia Spain says...
7:39pm Sat 15 Nov 08


Once again another terrible display,we cannot perform even the simple basics, Its no good just blaming the coaches,the players in this country are simply not up to the standard required to play at this level,somebody earlier said that most of these players are good enough to play in the N.R.L. can anybody name anyone who would command a regular first team place out of this lot, No I thought not

haitch, Lincolnshire says...
11:04am Sun 16 Nov 08

spanglishbull.uk wrote:
Once again another terrible display,we cannot perform even the simple basics, Its no good just blaming the coaches,the players in this country are simply not up to the standard required to play at this level,somebody earlier said that most of these players are good enough to play in the N.R.L. can anybody name anyone who would command a regular first team place out of this lot, No I thought not
You are right s/bull and you are stating the obvious.
Does anyone have the answer as to why were not goog enough?.

Tricky Dicky, Brunei says...
4:55am Mon 17 Nov 08

Yes, Haitch! The structure of the game and the competition, along with the class-driven bias that RL gets in the media. The Aussie system gets them all involved from 5 years old. Their competitions are tougher, more intense and more competitive. In Oz, RL is the Number 1 sport (RU and Soccer are for wussies). What do we need here? We can start by lifting the slaray cap and the overseas quota and get more of the better Antipodeans across here. Remember, Australia had a second and third national team that would easily beat GB. Toughness, fitness, quality and passion are needed. Super League has reduced quality, not improved it, for the sake of SKY's viewing figures. If we want to compete with the best nationally, we need to compete with the best in our weekly competitions. It wouldn't be a bad idea either for all our SL referees and coaches to have spent at least one season working at some capacity in the NRL. We have big fishes in a little pond, here, and look what happens when we are dumped in the ocean. Not all our fault but are we brave enough to take the action which is needed?

Gumshoe, Queensbury says...
8:28am Mon 17 Nov 08

haitch wrote:
spanglishbull.uk wrote: Once again another terrible display,we cannot perform even the simple basics, Its no good just blaming the coaches,the players in this country are simply not up to the standard required to play at this level,somebody earlier said that most of these players are good enough to play in the N.R.L. can anybody name anyone who would command a regular first team place out of this lot, No I thought not
You are right s/bull and you are stating the obvious. Does anyone have the answer as to why were not goog enough?.
How many overseas players do they have Haitch, count em on one hand for whole league, thats why better than us and everyone else. They nurture, coach, train and educate these players from really young age and develop them into world beaters every time. They put in financial resources to support their development and have backers from all over the country. They have massive exposure, on par if not more then the RU and the sport is treat as other sports and all of the above is unlike the UK. They pay their players a decent wage, not a stupid wage so they dont get players coming in just for the money (apart from Sonny Bill).

They have quality competitions such as Origin and they also have a quality and proven world class coach, again unlike us.

Nobby summed things up by saying where we have one or two players for a certain position, they have 10. If their 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th or 5th choice hookers for eg are injured, their 6,7,8, 9 or 10th choice could come ain and still be better than our first choice.


haitch, Lincolnshire says...
9:45am Mon 17 Nov 08

You are teaching your Granny how to suck eggs on that one Gumshoe as I lived in Sydney for 8 years!. All of what you say is true with the exception of their overseas playes. Don't forget their game is littered with players from NZ, Fiji, Tonga and PNG. You could say RL is the National game over there as Soccer is here hence the huge sponsorship and National backing.
Gumshoe, I wonder what the effect would be on the gates in this country would be if we banned overseas players and were asked to go and watch a bunch of kids being blooded?. I reckon gates would plummet and then our better players would have to go to Aus to earn a decent wage. My opinion is that we must keep club level Rugby as strong as possible and find a way forward from there. If the National team suffers perhaps we should accept we can't afford to worry about it.
We can never be like Ausssie because sports sponsorship in this country will always go to Soccer and Union and a host of other sports before League.

shaun from richmond, richmond says...
10:49am Mon 17 Nov 08

haitch wrote:
You are teaching your Granny how to suck eggs on that one Gumshoe as I lived in Sydney for 8 years!. All of what you say is true with the exception of their overseas playes. Don't forget their game is littered with players from NZ, Fiji, Tonga and PNG. You could say RL is the National game over there as Soccer is here hence the huge sponsorship and National backing. Gumshoe, I wonder what the effect would be on the gates in this country would be if we banned overseas players and were asked to go and watch a bunch of kids being blooded?. I reckon gates would plummet and then our better players would have to go to Aus to earn a decent wage. My opinion is that we must keep club level Rugby as strong as possible and find a way forward from there. If the National team suffers perhaps we should accept we can't afford to worry about it. We can never be like Ausssie because sports sponsorship in this country will always go to Soccer and Union and a host of other sports before League.
Thats pretty much garbage Haitch!
2 QUALITY overseas players max, would improve gates!!
Isnt one overseas player the Bulls have that would be classed as QUALITY! Just a bunch of has beens and off loads from NRL.
Rugby league in Britain has turned into a joke....and its really sad!!

Gumshoe, Queensbury says...
11:18am Mon 17 Nov 08

haitch wrote:
You are teaching your Granny how to suck eggs on that one Gumshoe as I lived in Sydney for 8 years!. All of what you say is true with the exception of their overseas playes. Don't forget their game is littered with players from NZ, Fiji, Tonga and PNG. You could say RL is the National game over there as Soccer is here hence the huge sponsorship and National backing. Gumshoe, I wonder what the effect would be on the gates in this country would be if we banned overseas players and were asked to go and watch a bunch of kids being blooded?. I reckon gates would plummet and then our better players would have to go to Aus to earn a decent wage. My opinion is that we must keep club level Rugby as strong as possible and find a way forward from there. If the National team suffers perhaps we should accept we can't afford to worry about it. We can never be like Ausssie because sports sponsorship in this country will always go to Soccer and Union and a host of other sports before League.
Haitch. I meant overseas as in players from these shores pal.

I am not sure they would plummet to be honest. I think it would help us get back to the 'grass routes' rugby we all love and it may bring us a new Farrell or Hanley in the process. Sadly we do not have the backing and support from the powers that be and financial backing and exposure given to other sports and the question always asked is why?

IMO it is a vicious circle. Backers and TV will not give it airtime and finances because the game is not as well known as Union, however, we will not get the game up to the level-par with Union unless given the above, we cant win.

I believe we should get a few of the big wigs in sport along to a grand final at OT or challenge cup final to see the game, passion, skill, power and speed of the teams and players, the massive mix of not only team supporters but supporters of rugby league in general and see that it is a quality sport that can grow with support and exposure.

I do think we need to cut down on the overseas to 2 or 3 three per club and get the likes of RL Raw back on screens as well as highlights of weeks games on primetime on Saturdays and repeated Sundays like they do with footy, snooker, racing etc

haitch, Lincolnshire says...
5:43pm Mon 17 Nov 08

Hi Shaun. Yes I see your point. Ricky Stuart said more or less the same as regards slashing overseas players in the UK.
This debate has raged for many years and there are two schools of thought generally. I happen to be on the other side and shudder to think what would happen to the game if we phased out overseas stars.

I believe the quality would fall and the gates too. As you so rightly point out as the Bulls overseas players have dropped in quality so have results and crowds. It could also be argued that when it was realised that Bulls were in financial trouble and couldn't afford top players anymore, even our local talent began to jump ship.Then theres the politics. I can't see the likes of Leeds, Wigan and Saints wanting to reduce to 2 nor many other teams. The clubs are running a business and want only the best in their shop windows.













haitch, Lincolnshire says...
5:57pm Mon 17 Nov 08

Gumshoe wrote:
haitch wrote: You are teaching your Granny how to suck eggs on that one Gumshoe as I lived in Sydney for 8 years!. All of what you say is true with the exception of their overseas playes. Don't forget their game is littered with players from NZ, Fiji, Tonga and PNG. You could say RL is the National game over there as Soccer is here hence the huge sponsorship and National backing. Gumshoe, I wonder what the effect would be on the gates in this country would be if we banned overseas players and were asked to go and watch a bunch of kids being blooded?. I reckon gates would plummet and then our better players would have to go to Aus to earn a decent wage. My opinion is that we must keep club level Rugby as strong as possible and find a way forward from there. If the National team suffers perhaps we should accept we can't afford to worry about it. We can never be like Ausssie because sports sponsorship in this country will always go to Soccer and Union and a host of other sports before League.
Haitch. I meant overseas as in players from these shores pal. I am not sure they would plummet to be honest. I think it would help us get back to the 'grass routes' rugby we all love and it may bring us a new Farrell or Hanley in the process. Sadly we do not have the backing and support from the powers that be and financial backing and exposure given to other sports and the question always asked is why? IMO it is a vicious circle. Backers and TV will not give it airtime and finances because the game is not as well known as Union, however, we will not get the game up to the level-par with Union unless given the above, we cant win. I believe we should get a few of the big wigs in sport along to a grand final at OT or challenge cup final to see the game, passion, skill, power and speed of the teams and players, the massive mix of not only team supporters but supporters of rugby league in general and see that it is a quality sport that can grow with support and exposure. I do think we need to cut down on the overseas to 2 or 3 three per club and get the likes of RL Raw back on screens as well as highlights of weeks games on primetime on Saturdays and repeated Sundays like they do with footy, snooker, racing etc
Hi Gumshoe. I can only say, the media give primetime TV to Soccer and not least because of all the overseas talent. Even Man U with all their home grow kids are known better for Ronaldo, Tevez and Berbatov. Chelsea and Arsenal teams speak for themslves. We live in a global world and I believe teams will continue to be global. Having teams of homegrown talent sounds great but it's not going to happen as I see it. Even the kids are attracted into the sport (soccer and RL) because they aspire to some of these greats.

Tricky Dicky, Brunei says...
4:23am Tue 18 Nov 08

Positive discrimination in favour of homegrown talent is doomed to failure in the same way it has failed in other parts of the world and in other environments e.g. Malysian Education, Bradford Council jobs. It creates a false competition base. If we want to compete globally with the best then we have to have as many of the best as we need in our national competitions. If our local talent is good enough then, eventually, they will reduce the need for expensive overseas talent. But, if you want protectionism then accept that we will never be able to compete internationally. It's a case of the cake and eating it.

haitch, Lincolnshire says...
10:03am Tue 18 Nov 08

Tricky Dicky wrote:
Positive discrimination in favour of homegrown talent is doomed to failure in the same way it has failed in other parts of the world and in other environments e.g. Malysian Education, Bradford Council jobs. It creates a false competition base. If we want to compete globally with the best then we have to have as many of the best as we need in our national competitions. If our local talent is good enough then, eventually, they will reduce the need for expensive overseas talent. But, if you want protectionism then accept that we will never be able to compete internationally. It's a case of the cake and eating it.
Wish I could have said it in such an eloquent manner! Spot on Dicky!

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